Go Back   AstinaGT Forums > AstinaGT Talk > General Automotive Talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 14-03-2004, 03:17 PM   #1
WASP20
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Perth WA
Posts: 10
SP20 VS SP23

My friend has just bought an SP23 and I drove it a fair bit yesterday and thought I would offer some thoughts as a comparison to my SP20, which I bought new last July.

My first impressions of the SP23 were good. The car has a distinct presence and looks very nice indeed from every angle. The sedan which my friend has is in my opinion the pick of the range. I find the front styling of the hatch a little too similar to the Chrysler PT retro and looks like it belongs more in the 1940s than the early 21st century in my humble opinion! The front of the sedan is softer and far more pleasing to the eye.

Inside, the car is quite different to the model it replaces. The cabin has a fresh and welcoming feel, however the controls are set further apart across the centre of the dashboard and whist looking more modern, does tend to make the panel look unnecessarily large. The guages are very nice indeed, and are only readable with the ignition on. The night lighting of these is problematic in my opinion, being back lit in blue. I had to feeling that the hi beam was always on when driving, and forgot every time to turn it off when a car came in the other direction, because the hi beam light is lost in all the blue surrounds.

Sitting in the back seat on the way home from the dealership, I noticed there is a fair bit more room in the back for passengers. The centre arm rest does not feel as sturdy as that in my car, however the centre rear passengers will be pleased to have a lap sash seat belt at last and passengers will also feel safe given the 6 SRS airbags in the car. When I went to open the back door to get out though, the backing plate for the door handle became unfixed and left a gaping rectangular hole in the door trim where it should have been sat. Upon inspection, the other side seemed well fixed, but I find it pretty unacceptable that these things are not quality checked prior to delivery.

Another negative was the feel of the steering wheel. The plastic feels quite cheap and most unsatisfactory after becoming used to the lovely Nardi wheel on my SP20. Whilst it only seems a small point, it really does let the car down and makes an otherwise classy interior seem cheap. The controls on the wheel for the stereo are a great improvement however and appear to be very user friendly and well thought out.

The doors are higher in the SP23 than the SP20, making it hard for me to get comfortable with the seat in the position it was in. I was not allowed to move the seat higher as my friend has spent half the day ajusting it for himself (!) so I was left sitting a little low, and with nowhere comfortable to put my right elbow! Usually I rest it on the window sill of my SP20, which is at the perfect height for me. Even with the seat raised I doubt I would have found a place to rest my elbow...the door closer seems too low and the sill too high.

Upon driving the car, I was astounded at how much road noise was transmitted to the cabin. The tyres are 50 series the same as the SP20, but are 17 inch not 16. However the tyre noise was incredible. Every surface change produces its own unique rumble and vibration. The brakes too were noisy. I will let that through to the keeper so to speak though, given the car had travelled less than 100km when I drove it, and the brakes were not bed in yet. However the noise from the tyres is plainly unacceptable and irritating. The engine nose from the cabin is bloody horrible too! I am not sure whether this particular car has a small hole already in the muffler or whether there is a poor fit in the system somwhere, but it sounds fluffly and very unsporting.

The car benefits from an extra 19KW of power and 24Nm of torque over my SP20, and feels every bit like a faster and more responsive machine. The acceleration is impressive, albeit I never floored the throttle pedal to really test the acceleration given, again, the car was less than 100km old. However it buzzed up to 60 km far faster than my SP20 does, and was very willing to continue past the local speed limit if I so desired! The engine seems to have a real urge to is from about 1500RPM and is a very good thing.

However the engine performance on its own is not enough to leave me with the overall impression that this is a vast improvement over my car. The handling is very similar, if not identical to my car, as is the firm ride. The brakes seem to have the same level of perfirmance and certainly stop not better or worse than my SP20.

In summary, no I am not going to rush out to upgrade to an SP23. I found all the improvements acheived by Mazda in the SP23 were countered by an equal number of negatives against the new vehicle. For example, the SP23 has variable intermittent wipers (why oh why the SP20 doesn't heaven knows!) and has a trick ambient temperature readout on its easy to read digital display, but it also has no spare alloy wheel, instead having only a skinny temporary use spare wheel which is a bright yellow solid disk and looks like something off my grandfather's wheelbarrow!


I am afraid none of the improvements dazzled me enough to come even close to believing the SP23 is a better car than the SP20. I disapponted my friend last night by saying to him that other than the extra power and torque, my car is a nicer car in every area. He also is disappointed with the car and thinks he will grow to be quite angry with some of the foibles of the SP23.

Come on Mazda...I am sure you can do better.

Check out here for a pic of the two cars together

http://wasp20.00freehost.com/sp20s.html
__________________
2003 Starry Blue Astina SP20

Mods:

Factory Cruise
Nothing else YET!
WASP20 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 14-03-2004, 03:41 PM   #2
Cosmo Dude
コスモ
 
Cosmo Dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Location: Vic
Car: Mazda '95 Astina I4, '86 B2K and '10 3 MZR-CD
Posts: 7,888
That's a good honest wrap of the SP23. It would be interesting if you had one for a week with different tyres :wink:
I guess it would need to be %120 of the SP20 to warrant updating, not just %105. I quite enjoy my BA but $20k to upgrade to the SP23 or $5k-$8k to rebuild the motor (it needs a rebuild) for an extra 20+kw?

Will wait to see the AWD turbo (dream)
__________________
My 'stina Hatch
Cosmo Dude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-03-2004, 03:52 PM   #3
MrShadow
Senior Time-waster
 
MrShadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Airborne somewhere in Aus...
Car: 2005 SP23 Hatch
Posts: 1,779
Send a message via MSN to MrShadow
Just out of interest, that link isn't working. If you want to link to it on that site, you're going to have link to an HTML file that has that image in it. 00freehost does not like people "hotlinking" (where you link from one site to a non-html file hosted on it's site).

Back to the topic, we've ordered an SP23, having only driven the Maxx Sport. Comparing the 2003 SP20 and the SP23, I'd have to say I agree that you wouldn't rush out and upgrade. However, comparing it to my Hardtop and Dad's '00 1.6 Protege, the situation changes somewhat. I found that road noise was much less noticeable in the Maxx Sport than either of our current cars, or indeed anything else that I have driven (bar a Toyota Corolla, those things are quiet-as). After driving the Hardtop up the freeway to Newcastle, your ears are left ringing (and no, it's not because I have the stereo cracked ..|.. ) Dad has poor hearing, so will not be bothered by the exhaust/engine noise anyway :lol: :lol: .

I must admit, I never thought of the blue backlighting of the dials interferring with the high-beam indicator. I've only seen the dash lit up once, and that was at the launch cocktail party at Gosford.

My personal opinion, for what it's worth (especially considering I'm biased in the matter), is that if it wasn't for financial reasons, the 3 is what Mazda should have released after the BA series. Mazda went from classy, stylish design, back to 'ye olde volvo-style-box design' and only now are coming back to classy, stylish designs that stand out on the road (put that in your pipes and smoke it, BJ boys! :lol: )
__________________
Gimme a caffeine drip and I'll be right....

Confuscias say "man who go to sleep with itchy bottom, wake up with smelly finger"
MrShadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-03-2004, 05:57 PM   #4
platypus
living in the past man
 
platypus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Newcastle, NSW
Car: Subaru Outback 2.0 turbo
Posts: 4,707
Send a message via MSN to platypus
classy? stylish? i still no like the BA shape, or the BK... i don't mind the BG,
anyways thats my bitching done...

by the way if you would like variable intermittent wipers go to Ford and ask about the wiper stalk for the KN laser.. like i did!!!!

if we are going for looks i'll wait for the mazdaspeed 3 thanks
__________________
1997 BG5 Subaru Outback - Now with STI boost...
platypus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-03-2004, 08:11 PM   #5
Asterix
AstinaGT Regular
 
Asterix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne, Vic
Car: Ex Astina, ex R34, ex 850R, currently Polo GTi
Posts: 431
Well WASP20, that was quite a thorough & concise summation of the SP23. I dropped into the local dealership & had a look at the new SP's when they were first released.
I was less then impressed with the styling of both, especially from the outside. The hatch especially sucked looking more like a wagon. The front nose looked (IMHO) a tad tacky. The audio system, although styled more "futuristically", left no thought by designers for most car enthusiasts who ditch the stock stezza & install an aftermarket head unit.
In the BJ series I would take a hatch over a sedan any day as the Protege (except for the sP series), I feel looks like the car your grandmother would drive to bowls :lol: .
With the new 2004 models, I think the hatches are too long & boh are too bulky looking (wonder what the weight/mass of these beasts are??). KW per tonne would be a good way to compare to the BJ.
There were some good styling/features about them, but just on pure aesthetics, I would take a BJ SP20 over the SP23. Also, the cost was around $35k!
I really like the sportiness of he Mazda 6 with the 17's & skirts & expected much more from the 3.
ops:
My 2 cents.
Asterix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-03-2004, 11:39 PM   #6
WASP20
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Perth WA
Posts: 10
The link works now that I have put the pic in an HTML document as suggested.

I never knew about the Laser wiper stalk fix for the intermittent wipers! I think I am going to have to look into it...thanks
__________________
2003 Starry Blue Astina SP20

Mods:

Factory Cruise
Nothing else YET!
WASP20 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-03-2004, 09:39 AM   #7
MrShadow
Senior Time-waster
 
MrShadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Airborne somewhere in Aus...
Car: 2005 SP23 Hatch
Posts: 1,779
Send a message via MSN to MrShadow
Cool, just had a look at te pic.

I much prefer the 23! I love smooth flowing "natural" lines on cars and the old SP20/BJ series is a bit boxy for my liking. The SP23, however is a bit more likeable. I did like the 6 design when it first came out, but now it's just "ho-hum", unless they've done something aftermarket to it. Having said that, I still love the old BG (?) design with the pop up headlights. That's a classic design.

Everybody has their own tastes, and mine is the for the SP23. That's not to say I wouldn't get an SP20 if I had just enough for one and couldn't stretch to the SP23, then again, mabey I would just do up the BA..hmmmm :? :? :?
__________________
Gimme a caffeine drip and I'll be right....

Confuscias say "man who go to sleep with itchy bottom, wake up with smelly finger"
MrShadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-03-2004, 10:36 AM   #8
platypus
living in the past man
 
platypus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Newcastle, NSW
Car: Subaru Outback 2.0 turbo
Posts: 4,707
Send a message via MSN to platypus
wasp20, my gf drives a laser... the only reason i knew about the stalk... its a direct change over

asterix i like my bowls car, and the amount of bowls drivers in astina sp20's astounds me!!!

anyway i like them all except for the new model (BK) ... i could live with them all but i'd rather have a BJ thanks
__________________
1997 BG5 Subaru Outback - Now with STI boost...
platypus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-03-2004, 08:16 PM   #9
Asterix
AstinaGT Regular
 
Asterix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne, Vic
Car: Ex Astina, ex R34, ex 850R, currently Polo GTi
Posts: 431
Haha, cool James. Each to my own.
My best mate has a 2002 'bowler' & he prefers them to the hatch. Reckons they suffer less from road noise too. I can't hear the road noise over the zorst anyway. Hehe.
I guess that's why they offer both to make everyone happy. Sedans for me are impractical as I like to throw the mountain bike in the back. It's too tricky in a sedan.
Asterix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-03-2004, 08:25 PM   #10
platypus
living in the past man
 
platypus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Newcastle, NSW
Car: Subaru Outback 2.0 turbo
Posts: 4,707
Send a message via MSN to platypus
my gf has a KN laser hatch, and the road noise is unbearable!!!

then again i have the zorst too....

but trunk rattle etc.. not hatches for me!!!

but as we all say each unto their own
__________________
1997 BG5 Subaru Outback - Now with STI boost...
platypus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-03-2004, 11:38 PM   #11
ezin
AstinaGT Regular
 
ezin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: melb
Posts: 416
MMM just looked at that link (finally)

The old one is heaps more agressive! And that ones sitting up a mile and has the newer wheels on it (Sorry i like the original sp20 wheels, they suit the body lines!) And orange side indicators! aaahhh!

Personally i like the old one a lot better from a modifying point of view! The only good 3 i have seen is a hatch and thats from this site!

http://www.corksport.com/main.php3?p...tory84.content

Why they did not do that straight of is stupid!
ezin is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sp20 with Sp23 wheels on. ezin Suspension & Wheels 12 24-03-2006 07:47 PM
SP23 rims on SP20 DF51 Suspension & Wheels 21 09-08-2005 10:47 AM
dba brake rotors - sp20 twilightprotege Performance & General Maintenance 50 23-08-2004 01:38 PM
Thrashed SP23 sedan on weekend. kyra General Automotive Talk 8 17-02-2004 08:52 AM
sp20 bits + sports exhaust dfvadr Bodykits & Exterior 4 04-10-2003 11:17 PM


All times are GMT +10. The time now is 12:08 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
2001- 2010 AstinaGT