460cc injectors fitted

ROB-80E · 10-04-2005, 01:23 AM

Well guys, I've finally got round to fitting the 460cc Series IV (i think) 13b N/A injectors I got off ebay ages ago. Reasons for not fitting was that after I'd been told that all RX7 injectors are bolt in, THEY AREN'T. In the RX7's, any of the Peak and Hold series injectors (low ohm/impedence) have a bigger nozzel than the Saturated (high ohm/impedence) injectors found in the later 13b N/A engines.

I had the injectors serviced prior to fitting...this included replacing the nozzel caps, head seal (grommet), top grommet, o-ring and also cleaned and flow tested. Cost was $30/injector.

Well anyway, fitting wasn't hard once I got started. Intake pipes and intake manifold were removed so that I could insure that no metal would get inside the engine. With making sure the valves were closed and a rag wedged in the port I proceeded to drill (with gritted teeth) the injector ports in the head larger. The standard port is 9.5mm and I redrilled exactly 1mm larger and this made a perfect fit for the nozzels on the new injectors.

Apart from the head ports, these injectors fit perfectly into the standard GTX fuel rail.

Again the difference with the low ohm injector out of the RX7 is that the plug is different...I already had a set of plugs lying round in the spares bucket to suit, so it wasn't hard to me to chop and solder and heat shink the plugs into the injector loom I made for the Microtech. Because I do have an aftermarket ECU, I don't have to worry about a resistor pack...they just plug straight in and the Microtech will drive them with no problems.

I have already started the car and as expected it was very rich. Haven't attempted to drive it yet....will do that tomorrow and attemp a quick road tune with ajusting the injectors pulses down to a safe level that I won't go through a tank of fuel a day and stuff my spark plugs before I can get it retuned for more boost and power

Aim is for 220WHP on whatever boost the mighty VF10 hybrid will manage. heheh.

Dogo · 10-04-2005, 08:36 AM

nice !

did you get them cleaned and pattern tested first ?

also can you tell me if standard bpt injectors are peak and hold or not ?

ROB-80E · 10-04-2005, 12:08 PM

Quote:

I had the injectors serviced prior to fitting...this included replacing the nozzel caps, head seal (grommet), top grommet, o-ring and also cleaned and flow tested. Cost was $30/injector.

Yeah mate, it was included in the above ^^^^

Standard BPT injectors are Saturated (high ohm). BPD injectors are peak and hold and flow a **** LOAD more. Basically the service manual states that the GTR's injector flow minimum is rated at the GTX's maximum.

Dogo · 10-04-2005, 02:58 PM

thnx. i'll note that down for when I put my wolf in.

so is there a reason you didnt just use the GTR ones ?

ROB-80E · 10-04-2005, 08:25 PM

Yeah, couldn't find any. Plus I didn't want to go too big. Basically my car is still an everyday car, so I'm after everyday performance, and that mean a bit of everyday fuel consumption too. If I was to use GTR or 550cc injectors, they wouldn't be used to their potential and would be hard to tune because they'd use a very small percentage of their duty cycle and mostly run rich.

I just felt that the 460's would be a better match for my setup, plus these ones only cost me $115 landend for the set.

QuicKSilveR · 12-04-2005, 09:27 AM

MMmm, Yes looking very good Robbo. Good luck with traction with more power. Those VF10s are brutal little things on the tyres.

89sp1.8 · 06-02-2008, 11:11 PM

old thread digging..

so the 13b N/A injectors,if got high impedence ones they should be straight fit as dont have the larger nozzel like the low impedence ones?
and bpt having square plug,offset high impedence..

***88 13B NonTurbo high square offset 460cc purple 195500-1350 ***
or
***88 13b Turbo high square offset 550cc purple 195500-1370 ****

BigMal · 07-02-2008, 02:07 PM

BPT's dont have a square plug B6T's do.
Look at the pics on this link to see the diff between the plugs.

http://www.injectorsonline.com/indivprod.php?c=4

89sp1.8 · 07-02-2008, 05:14 PM

ah i see,cheers mal. was miss informed on fl.com thread,says bpt are square and bpd are oval plugs.

chicaboo · 07-02-2008, 05:17 PM

I have 195500-2130 BPT injectors right here in my hand, and they have a black round plug. I also checked my B6T plugs, and they are square. I will check my B6T JDM plugs, but I think they are round too. Fark I'm lucky I have those!

Gav.

89sp1.8 · 07-02-2008, 05:28 PM

ok then cheers..well alot of diff info flying round..fl says bpt are square and bpd are oval..injector site says bp and bpd are same fit..and gtx ones turn out to be round in the end.

chicaboo · 07-02-2008, 05:37 PM

Well, they could be on smack, or maybe Mazda revised the plugs in the S2 facelift on the Familia. However it's most likely that the AUDM cars (TX3) had one style of plug where the JDM cars had another...

Gav.

Rupewrecht · 07-02-2008, 05:41 PM

take some photos, create a thread, and i'll make it a sticky

chicaboo · 07-02-2008, 05:58 PM

OK, I will catalogue everything I have when I get the time. I can tell you the origins of the 2 sets of B6T injectors, but I can't tell you what the BPT injectors I have are out of... However, I know the flow rates at 3bar for them all.

Gav.

dave0r · 07-02-2008, 06:28 PM

meh

Evo 1 - 3 injectors, 510cc , perfect fit to the head/rail/seals etc

just the plugs are different, but they are a common standard mitsi plug

89sp1.8 · 07-02-2008, 06:57 PM

ok kewl.

hey big mal howd u go with fittin gtr injectors,them bring low impedence,u have to do same as rob?( re drill 1mm bigger)
or is that just with rx7 injectors

ROB-80E · 07-02-2008, 07:34 PM

It's just with the RX7 ones. BPT and BPD injectors are the share the same plug shape, but that's all they share.

BPT - Black top (oval plug)
BPD - Orange top (oval plug)
RX7 13B - Red top (oval = high ohm, square = low ohm and larger pintle cap)
RX7 13BT - Purple top (oval plug)

From what I remember with Mal, he has an aftermarket ECU and they don't care what ohm the injectors are.

89sp1.8 · 08-02-2008, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROB-80E

It's just with the RX7 ones. BPT and BPD injectors are the share the same plug shape, but that's all they share.

BPT - Black top (oval plug)
BPD - Orange top (oval plug)
RX7 13B - Red top (oval = high ohm, square = low ohm and larger pintle cap)
RX7 13BT - Purple top (oval plug)

From what I remember with Mal, he has an aftermarket ECU and they don't care what ohm the injectors are.

ah ok kewl all cleared up then.

chicaboo · 07-02-2008, 07:42 PM

What happens if you mix and match high/low impedance injectors with a stock ECU?

Gav.

ROB-80E · 07-02-2008, 09:07 PM

you wouldn't mix and match different impedance injectors full stop. They have different opening charactoristics, hence they have different names...saturated or peak and hold.

If you mean, swap a set of low ohm injectors with high ohm, potentially there shouldn't be any adverse effect on the ECU. The other way though (high ohm to low) is a different story. Think of the injectors as a pure resistor. Lower ohm resistors allow more current to flow. Hence with an injector, they will draw more current through the driver IC/Transister/FET/MosFET causing more heat and eventually a breakdown in the component. In simple terms, you can blow up the ECU.

10-04-2005, 01:23 AM	#1
ROB-80E Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: SE QLD, Australia Car: Turbo BG Astina Posts: 792 View Photos By: ROB-80E	460cc injectors fitted Well guys, I've finally got round to fitting the 460cc Series IV (i think) 13b N/A injectors I got off ebay ages ago. Reasons for not fitting was that after I'd been told that all RX7 injectors are bolt in, THEY AREN'T. In the RX7's, any of the Peak and Hold series injectors (low ohm/impedence) have a bigger nozzel than the Saturated (high ohm/impedence) injectors found in the later 13b N/A engines. I had the injectors serviced prior to fitting...this included replacing the nozzel caps, head seal (grommet), top grommet, o-ring and also cleaned and flow tested. Cost was $30/injector. Well anyway, fitting wasn't hard once I got started. Intake pipes and intake manifold were removed so that I could insure that no metal would get inside the engine. With making sure the valves were closed and a rag wedged in the port I proceeded to drill (with gritted teeth) the injector ports in the head larger. The standard port is 9.5mm and I redrilled exactly 1mm larger and this made a perfect fit for the nozzels on the new injectors. Apart from the head ports, these injectors fit perfectly into the standard GTX fuel rail. Again the difference with the low ohm injector out of the RX7 is that the plug is different...I already had a set of plugs lying round in the spares bucket to suit, so it wasn't hard to me to chop and solder and heat shink the plugs into the injector loom I made for the Microtech. Because I do have an aftermarket ECU, I don't have to worry about a resistor pack...they just plug straight in and the Microtech will drive them with no problems. I have already started the car and as expected it was very rich. Haven't attempted to drive it yet....will do that tomorrow and attemp a quick road tune with ajusting the injectors pulses down to a safe level that I won't go through a tank of fuel a day and stuff my spark plugs before I can get it retuned for more boost and power Aim is for 220WHP on whatever boost the mighty VF10 hybrid will manage. heheh. __________________ BG Astina + GTR conversion + Microtech ECU + FMIC + 3" pipes and Exhaust x 21psi boost = 12.168 to the power of 326whp

10-04-2005, 08:25 PM	#5
ROB-80E Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: SE QLD, Australia Car: Turbo BG Astina Posts: 792 View Photos By: ROB-80E	Yeah, couldn't find any. Plus I didn't want to go too big. Basically my car is still an everyday car, so I'm after everyday performance, and that mean a bit of everyday fuel consumption too. If I was to use GTR or 550cc injectors, they wouldn't be used to their potential and would be hard to tune because they'd use a very small percentage of their duty cycle and mostly run rich. I just felt that the 460's would be a better match for my setup, plus these ones only cost me $115 landend for the set. __________________ BG Astina + GTR conversion + Microtech ECU + FMIC + 3" pipes and Exhaust x 21psi boost = 12.168 to the power of 326whp

12-04-2005, 09:27 AM	#6
QuicKSilveR AstinaGT Regular Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Brisbane Car: '01 Nissan Silvia s15 (Ex Ford Laser TX3 Turbo FAN74) Posts: 343 View Photos By: QuicKSilveR	MMmm, Yes looking very good Robbo. Good luck with traction with more power. Those VF10s are brutal little things on the tyres. __________________ Mazda Fours :: Mazda Four Cylinder Performance Club http://www.mazdafours.com

06-02-2008, 11:11 PM	#7
89sp1.8 Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: brisbane Car: bg astina Posts: 1,186	old thread digging.. so the 13b N/A injectors,if got high impedence ones they should be straight fit as dont have the larger nozzel like the low impedence ones? and bpt having square plug,offset high impedence.. *88 13B NonTurbo high square offset 460cc purple 195500-1350 * or *88 13b Turbo high square offset 550cc purple 195500-1370 ** Last edited by 89sp1.8; 06-02-2008 at 11:21 PM.

07-02-2008, 02:07 PM	#8
BigMal 1ST BA TURBO MEMBER Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Sydney Car: BA Astina Turbo Posts: 4,195 View Photos By: BigMal	BPT's dont have a square plug B6T's do. Look at the pics on this link to see the diff between the plugs. http://www.injectorsonline.com/indivprod.php?c=4 __________________ If you want wind in your hair add a Hairdryer !!!

10-04-2005, 08:36 AM	#2
Dogo Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Melb, Aus Car: Mazda 323 BA BPT transplant Posts: 3,459 View Photos By: Dogo	nice ! did you get them cleaned and pattern tested first ? also can you tell me if standard bpt injectors are peak and hold or not ?

10-04-2005, 02:58 PM	#4
Dogo Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Melb, Aus Car: Mazda 323 BA BPT transplant Posts: 3,459 View Photos By: Dogo	thnx. i'll note that down for when I put my wolf in. so is there a reason you didnt just use the GTR ones ?

07-02-2008, 05:14 PM	#9
89sp1.8 Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: brisbane Car: bg astina Posts: 1,186	ah i see,cheers mal. was miss informed on fl.com thread,says bpt are square and bpd are oval plugs.

07-02-2008, 05:17 PM	#10
chicaboo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Logan prefecture Car: Touge monster Posts: 7,585	I have 195500-2130 BPT injectors right here in my hand, and they have a black round plug. I also checked my B6T plugs, and they are square. I will check my B6T JDM plugs, but I think they are round too. Fark I'm lucky I have those! Gav. Last edited by chicaboo; 07-02-2008 at 05:26 PM.

07-02-2008, 05:28 PM	#11
89sp1.8 Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: brisbane Car: bg astina Posts: 1,186	ok then cheers..well alot of diff info flying round..fl says bpt are square and bpd are oval..injector site says bp and bpd are same fit..and gtx ones turn out to be round in the end.

07-02-2008, 05:37 PM	#12
chicaboo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Logan prefecture Car: Touge monster Posts: 7,585	Well, they could be on smack, or maybe Mazda revised the plugs in the S2 facelift on the Familia. However it's most likely that the AUDM cars (TX3) had one style of plug where the JDM cars had another... Gav.

07-02-2008, 05:41 PM	#13
Rupewrecht Administrator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: melb.vic.au Car: AZ-1, Astina Hardtop Turbo, BJ Protege, Beetle Posts: 16,525 View Photos By: Rupewrecht	take some photos, create a thread, and i'll make it a sticky __________________ jdmparts.rupewrecht.com Sourcing your not-quite-overnight parts from Japan WRECHT--\|--SLOWTEGE--\|--BEETLE--\|--SUBSTITUTE--\|--AZ-1

07-02-2008, 05:58 PM	#14
chicaboo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Logan prefecture Car: Touge monster Posts: 7,585	OK, I will catalogue everything I have when I get the time. I can tell you the origins of the 2 sets of B6T injectors, but I can't tell you what the BPT injectors I have are out of... However, I know the flow rates at 3bar for them all. Gav.

07-02-2008, 06:28 PM	#15
dave0r AstinaGT Regular Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Tauranga Car: Astina GT Turbo Posts: 302 View Photos By: dave0r	meh Evo 1 - 3 injectors, 510cc , perfect fit to the head/rail/seals etc just the plugs are different, but they are a common standard mitsi plug __________________ 1996 ST205 Toyota Celica GT4 Gone 1991 Astina GT, 102wkw/138whp Built a KL-ZE 220whp engine for a KF Laser

07-02-2008, 06:57 PM	#16
89sp1.8 Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: brisbane Car: bg astina Posts: 1,186	ok kewl. hey big mal howd u go with fittin gtr injectors,them bring low impedence,u have to do same as rob?( re drill 1mm bigger) or is that just with rx7 injectors

07-02-2008, 07:34 PM	#17
ROB-80E Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: SE QLD, Australia Car: Turbo BG Astina Posts: 792 View Photos By: ROB-80E	It's just with the RX7 ones. BPT and BPD injectors are the share the same plug shape, but that's all they share. BPT - Black top (oval plug) BPD - Orange top (oval plug) RX7 13B - Red top (oval = high ohm, square = low ohm and larger pintle cap) RX7 13BT - Purple top (oval plug) From what I remember with Mal, he has an aftermarket ECU and they don't care what ohm the injectors are. __________________ BG Astina + GTR conversion + Microtech ECU + FMIC + 3" pipes and Exhaust x 21psi boost = 12.168 to the power of 326whp

07-02-2008, 07:42 PM	#19
chicaboo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Logan prefecture Car: Touge monster Posts: 7,585	What happens if you mix and match high/low impedance injectors with a stock ECU? Gav.

07-02-2008, 09:07 PM	#20
ROB-80E Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: SE QLD, Australia Car: Turbo BG Astina Posts: 792 View Photos By: ROB-80E	you wouldn't mix and match different impedance injectors full stop. They have different opening charactoristics, hence they have different names...saturated or peak and hold. If you mean, swap a set of low ohm injectors with high ohm, potentially there shouldn't be any adverse effect on the ECU. The other way though (high ohm to low) is a different story. Think of the injectors as a pure resistor. Lower ohm resistors allow more current to flow. Hence with an injector, they will draw more current through the driver IC/Transister/FET/MosFET causing more heat and eventually a breakdown in the component. In simple terms, you can blow up the ECU. __________________ BG Astina + GTR conversion + Microtech ECU + FMIC + 3" pipes and Exhaust x 21psi boost = 12.168 to the power of 326whp

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