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Old 04-11-2003, 10:30 AM   #1
IzzYTaP
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SP20 TURBO KITS

Hi Everyone,

After reading wiredone's (Doug's) posting on his Hiboost Turbo Kit installation, I thought I'd post the three kits I've been looking at and the cost of buying and importing from the US.

Check the websites for each kits inclusions.

All prices are based on the AUS$ buying USD$0.70 . Postage was costed on delivery to Canberra.

Buying a couple kits at a time may bring the price down.

HiBoost - www.hiboost.com/products.html :wink:
8psi Turbo Kit : USD$3995 AUD$5722
UPS Postage : USD$150 AUD$212
Subtotal : AUD$5934
Customs Duty 15% : AUD$890
GST 10% : AUD$682
TOTAL: AUD$7506

Wagner Motorsports - www.wagnermotorsports.net/products.php
6psi Turbo Kit : USD$3650 AUD$5230
UPS Postage : USD$150 AUD$212
Subtotal : AUD$5442
Customs Duty 15% : AUD$816
GST 10% : AUD$625
TOTAL : AUD$6883

Flyin Protege - http://flyinmiata.com/protege/tech/specs.asp
6psi Turbo Kit : USD$3595 AUD$5150
UPS Postage : USD$150 AUD$212
Subtotal : AUD$5362
Customs Duty 15% : AUD$804
GST 10% : AUD$616
TOTAL : AUD$6782

I personally would kill for the HiBoost kit!! :twisted:

Any comments ??

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Old 04-11-2003, 07:24 PM   #2
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It is interesting to look at the kit options available to us from the States.

I can't help thinking that there ought to be a way to keep the costs down with some local sourcing of things we can get ourselves.

For example, the IHI turbo used in the HiBoost kit comes from Japan....via the U.S.....and we pay shipping half way across the globe twice, duties, handling, profit margin etc. same goes for any of the turbos.

Likewise, we have excellent quality sources here for intercoolers, custom pipe manufacturers etc etc so the price should be so much cheaper "doing it smart" so to speak.

The upside of the kits is, as wiredone says, installed in 2 days.

For me the issue is price for an imported kit fitted is exxy, putting the pieces together here takes time as plenty here have discovered.
Weeks become months, car is off the road, development yada yada......

So I am stuck in price vs down-time and mucking around, neither of which I am real happy with.....

The other issue is that the U.S. spec car is in fact not exactly the same, which concerns me a bit.

They run theirs on 91 octane with 9:1 compression, ours are 10:1 for minimum 95 octane....which leads to potential problems ie does the cooler work efficiently enough to avoid potential detonation at the higher compression given the pre-programming of the ECU mapping which is in fact for a different car?

All of that said, i am all for a real getting our heads together and working out a solution.

There are plenty of people here who have "been there done that" and sourced suppliers etc so that if we got organised and did a few installations all together we could come up with a good result IMO.
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Old 05-11-2003, 12:37 AM   #3
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hi there guys,
well this is how our decision on the hiboost kit went...

firstly is has fuel managment... which was a must as our cars need to be in differing environments and we need have the car prepared to take on the world... because a car that keeps stuffing around is a car that makes no profit as it is always in for warranty work...

the hiboost kit is also thekit we found to be the most complete. It comes with things that others charge for in the base model kit... FMIC, fuel management, boost controllers... etc. There is no point selling a kit for a couple of thousand dollars if it doesnt have the eww and ahh factor as well... i mean for the money your spending... it is also the one which runs more boost than others out of the box...

we have also heard very bad things about some of the other kits (not rumour mongoring) and in our opinion from what i have heard apart from the hiboost and the flyinprotege kit the rest don't look after the car too well. With stories of pistons blowing out... even before you blow a rocker... nasty!

answers:
- We have not found a problem with the intercooler found in hiboosts kit to have any problem avoiding detonation... if you were to run crappy fuel i cannot gurantee it will be very happy, it may ping, but that is the case for most off the shelf turbo cars... eg the WRX. This problem can usually be solved by upgrading the haltech F10 to a Haltech E6X so you can play with the timing... but our car runs the F10 on 98 octane fuel without a hitch...
- We have mapped the car here in australia... it is not the standard hiboost map, we have tuned it
- I'll also add for the record the Hiboost instructions are the not the best either... but we've re-written them... =)
- The Street Dreams/Hiboost kit is slightly different from the actual Hiboost kit, we have slightly modified some things so that it all fits in the car... So your paying for our development and tuning work as well

Although i must add that if anyone is bringing a non-hiboost kit into australia i'll be more than willing to help at any stage... not just a rep but an astina owner too

I will also add that if need be and someone wants us to bring in another turbo kit or any other part, we will be happy to try and get it at trade for you... but only if your a cool astinagt.com member
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Old 05-11-2003, 07:17 AM   #4
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Thanks for that wiredone, cleared some stuff up really well. Onya.

I do a lot of travelling about the place and have had some trouble getting genuine 98 octane. The local BP only keeps the 95 stuff of the 2 grades they have, for instance....

Last year on a trip back from Adelaide, I had to buy regular unleaded when nearly dry as there was no premium to be had town after (infrequent ) town.....

When you live out of the city proper and do a lot of country driving, 98 octane is a fair dinkum problem.

I'm banging my head (and it doesn't need the damage....) coz with my car as it will shortly be, add some kw and it would be just PERFECT.......
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Old 05-11-2003, 12:16 PM   #5
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well i can tell you this very simply...
i have also filled up on the freeway with standard or 95/96....
as long as you dont hit full boost under load at 100% throttle your really not going to have trouble...

when we first finished putting the car together we had a full tank of crappy 7/eleven fuel in it.... and we drove it hard for 30 mins before it pinged and it did it so ever lightly we nearly all missed it... although the ECU didn't it retarded the timing and the car went kinda flat...

you shouldn't really get ping if you drive the car light... as your not putting it nder enough pressure... freeway driving shouldnt be an issue unless you put your foot flat to overtake up a hill and your in 5th
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Old 05-11-2003, 05:08 PM   #6
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I've spent a bit of time looking through the protege5 forums which are US based an discovered a few things... As far as i know, and i'm not professing to be entirely correct...

1. The engine the Americans got in their 'protege 5's' is identical to ours in spec other than missing the plastic rocker cover...

2. I spent time arguing about their fuel where they told me quite abruptly that their octane rating system differs from our RON system and that their 91/92 octane 'premium' unleaded is equivalent to our 98RON optimax and bp ultimate...


Also, i reckon if you ad up all the associated costs of building a custom turbo setup for our cars, i reckon the kits are pretty damn cheap!
1. Custom manifold - $800 - 1000
2. Second hand BB T28 Turbo - $800
3. Dump pipe - $200
4. All cooler piping - $1200
5. Piggy back computer + programming - $1000
6. Intercooler core - $800

APPROX. TOTAL - $5000 plus fitting work...

AND... that's using second hand components, no garauntee of performance gains, lots of time off the road, lots of extra dyno tuning time, custom made pipes look inferior etc etc etc.

I know what i'll be doing when i've got the cash... hiboost!

The way the USD is sinking at the moment the kits are getting cheaper by the day too!! hehehe
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Old 05-11-2003, 08:57 PM   #7
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Andrew is mostly spot on about the costs. A well thought out kit is ALWAYS going to be cheaper than DIY development unless you have a stack of mates in the trade and good access to bits. That's the same for anycar!

I'm sure wiredone will back this up - he has a kit, has mates int he trade and still has had to work at it a bit!

Kit's win thanks to pre made manifolds and having all the ancillary bits and pices in the right place first go without the need to test fabricate and refit 10 times to get somethings that's about right.

I and some other aussies worked on the Chrysler tot he point of getting together the bits to develop a turbo solution locally and by the time we'd sourced the parts (manifolds to cut up, sensors, ECU to contro the thing and a WRX turbo in top condition) we would have chewed through about $1K before having anything more than a set of intercooler brackets fabricated up and a cooler mounted into the front bar.

Add that to the high risk of grenading the first motor you build and well suddenly a $7K kit seems cheap.
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Old 05-11-2003, 09:32 PM   #8
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Hi Wiredone,

I am a cool astinagt.com member, so I would like to take you up on that VERY generous offer of giving advice. At the moment I am looking at getting the SPOOL Stage 1 kit. The kit retails for US$2595. This kit includes the following:

-Race fabricated manifold
-High speed balanced Garrett turbo
-Fuel Management Unit pre set to proper fuel pressure levels
-02 signal modifier is included to prevent ECU fuel pull at partial throttle.
-Stainless steel braided oil lines with anodized fittings
-Turbonetics external wastegate
-Installation guide and support
-Pre gapped turbo spark plugs
-Healthy 2.5 inch race downpipe
-Forged Steel Manifolds with a 5 year warranty!
-Polished Stainless Steel Piping Tig welded
-Turbo Tuff Silicone Hoses
-Beefy Stainless Clamps

As you can see this kit doesn't have all the bells and whistles that the HiBoost kit has. I cannot afford to spend $8000-$10000 on a turbo kit. So I thought I would do it bit by bit. I Have a UniChip fuel management computer already installed, so I am going to get that taken out of the kit. So all up it should cost me about $3700 to get that kit into Aus. Then once I get some more money I will add something onto the system, i.e., intercooler. I know it would probably be a bit cheaper in the long run to get a complete kit now, but I cannot do that.

What do you think about this setup? Do you have any recommendations?

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Old 05-11-2003, 09:42 PM   #9
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i have heard some good things about the spool kit... no complaints yet i think... at least from the guys in the states... spool has a good reputation with protege5 owners so i can't see a problem there...

i would ask what fuel management they are using... because without being a complete party pooper unichips really do sweat f all when it comes to real ECU work... or so i have been told. Our Ecu guys worked at haltech for 8 years and installs every type of ecu under the sun, from autronics, microtech, power fc and everything else and he still swears by haltechs... and if it helps its an aussie company =)

there are usually some issues with all turbo kits coming from the states... there radiators believe it or not are abit thinner giving the turbo more room including downpipes. bit of modding and you should be right there though... there are a few other things that are different and can be sorted so pm if you have trouble

The thing i also like about the spool kit is like the hiboost, it is upgradable... they swear by there product and they do it so much that they trust you will come back and upgrade... thats usually a good thing... not some dodgy asian superstore selling altezza's

just my 2c.... value for money = good... obviously i am biased because we sell the hiboost kits and my car has one in it but.. each to there own... enjoy the boost if you buy it... the dark side spreads...

Aaron: i will back you up... between getting the kit here, modifying brackets, altering sensor layouts, and then retune upon retune upon retune to get it just perfect... risking the first engine... even with my best mate owning a shop... added up very very quickly... and obviously i wasn't paying labour, so god forbid if i was...
The main reason we put together the kit was... i bought an sp20 for the potential... got pissed off no one had an offering for us... so we created the offering... =) sp20 products driven by an sp20 owner... we sell eye lids for them... cause i got em made for my car... we're about to start seeling body kits etc for them... cause i want sp20's to look cool... obviously not become the next lancer with every wog and his dog driving one but cool in its own non-widespread kinds way... people still like my car when they see it and from the outside it nearly ( i say nearly ) looks stock... go the mazda astina owners! :lol:
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Old 05-11-2003, 10:03 PM   #10
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Hmmm, boost...

I gotta drive that thing......
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Old 05-11-2003, 11:19 PM   #11
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come pay us a visit and take it for a drive....

=)

only if your not trying to avoid addiction...

i have been told by our other people who have come to test drive that the drive home is very slow...=p
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Old 06-11-2003, 07:20 AM   #12
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Wiredone: How long does the stock clutch hold up??

I know it would definately need upgrading with twice the engine power output, but that's another expense that everyone's gotta consider when getting a turbo...

How much is a decent clutch worth to hold down 200kW at the fly??
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Old 06-11-2003, 05:23 PM   #13
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I DID IT!!!!! I placed an order for the Spool stage 1 kit. My pockets feel so much lighter. All up it was US$2950. That includes shipping and an upgraded Tial wastegate, but i didn't get the FMU.

Wiredone: the FMU that comes with the kit was only US$150, so i can't see it being a decent unit. The UniChip will have to do untill i can get my hands onto a Haltech computer. I didn't get the intercooler upgrade, i thought i might be able to source that from here. Do you sell a intercooler kit, if so how much. Also, i have already wrote down what comes in the kit. Do you reccomend any other bit i should get, i.e. Turbo timer, boost controller, boost gauge, etc. Remember though that i'm trying to this all bit by bit, so if it really isn't urgently needed then it's something i will get later. Thanks for you help. Are you going to have your car at the Auto Salon this weekend?

Thanks,
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Old 07-11-2003, 11:27 AM   #14
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i'd definitely get a turbo timer... just because the car wasn't designed to take boost so it needs all the love it can get... no sadly my cars plans for autosalon kinda fell through when money from work decreased... =( next may...

i would also straight away go to unichip and get the ecu retuned because it needs to run a totally different mixture, and cold start will be a completely different affair...
to drive the car before u get fuel mixture right go light and give it ten mins to warm up.... can never be too careful

well depending on the haltech your after i might have a deal for you soon... when i get the forgies and my haltech e6x you can have my f10....

its official though... you HAVE to meet up with me when its done... =) boost makes the world keep turning....
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Old 07-11-2003, 10:27 PM   #15
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I called up Spool this morning and made some other upgrades to the Kit. I already mentioned the Tial wastegate, i also upgraded the BOV to the HKS Super Sequential BOV. I also got a Greddy 60mm electric boost gauge.

Once i get it in i would love to meet up. So once it's done i will get in contact with you, or we could even try to organise another meet because i haven't been on one yet.

Also, keep me in mind if you are selling anything, i.e. the f10.

Thanks.
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Old 08-11-2003, 12:55 AM   #16
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great... ok keep in mind im pretty sure the super sequential won't go past 10psi so if your thinking of keeping on goin it might not be an option... can't remember specifics... anyone back me up?

as i mentioned... you need help with anything don't hesitate to call us at the shop...
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Old 08-11-2003, 07:43 AM   #17
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They have 2 valves in them. 1opens under low boost, 1 opens under high boost.
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Old 08-11-2003, 12:48 PM   #18
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Some one back there mentioned import duty 15%, is that for anything and everything? including my mate sending me stuff as a GIFT?

Now if I avoid import duties, it should be cheaper.

wiredone if I get the HIBOOST kit, how much to install it? and what other changes do I need to make, and btw wtf is going to be the deal with insurance?
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Old 08-11-2003, 01:28 PM   #19
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If someone states that the package is a gift, then you won't be charged the tax. You can also get the sender to state that the cost of the package is much less then what you paid for it. For example, if you paid US$3000 for a kit the sender could write the price as $600. This means that if you get charged any taxes it will be on the $600 instead of the $3000. I got really lucky. The people down at Spool at FANTASTIC. I'm having my kit sent to my mechanic, which means that Spool can say that the package is a trade sample. This means that ABSOLUTELY no taxes will be charged to me.

Good luck
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Old 08-11-2003, 04:25 PM   #20
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TDK, what is the url for spool?

Also I did compare the flyin miata protege kit vs the Hi Boost kit, the power difference is huge? unless one is measuring from different point or are they both from the front wheels?
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