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Old 06-12-2010, 07:31 PM   #1
SLY 323
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KL-ZE, BP, BP-T, FE3 & KF-ZE Discussion!

Hi all!

I am just wondering if there are any how to's or guides to swap the 1.8 BA Hatch to the KL-ZE 2.5?

Or for that, if it's even possible?

Also, does anyone know if the series 1 1.8 gearbox will bolt up to the 2.5 KL-ZE and work?

I know for the swap some things I'm going to have to focus on are the gearbox if I need a mx6 gearbox, the engine mounts for if they line up, I'll need the MX-6 ECU as far as I know, and might have to upgrade the fuel pump as well, but from what I know the rest is a straight bolt on yeah?

I've read the sticky, but not enough information there, just seeking some more opinions?

Cheers guys!
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Old 06-12-2010, 07:43 PM   #2
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http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showt...ZE-Swap-Thread

Now I can see it works for the BJ with not to much trouble!

Still doesn't help with the BA unfortunatly...
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Old 06-12-2010, 08:07 PM   #3
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Ye it will fit ofcourse, but it's cheaper/ easier to get a ba with a v6 so a f vin ratherthan a p vin (pref busted engine so its cheper) and swap it from there.. That way all the brakes, shafts, and mechanical are more suited
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Old 06-12-2010, 08:17 PM   #4
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Ye it will fit ofcourse, but it's cheaper/ easier to get a ba with a v6 so a f vin ratherthan a p vin (pref busted engine so its cheper) and swap it from there.. That way all the brakes, shafts, and mechanical are more suited
With the F VIN rather than the P, if there any problem other than the fact that the V6's have the brakes and shafts. I'll upgrade the brakes and new shafts and what not. I'm not to fussed anbout the ABS. I can deal without that. Unless no one reccomends driving something that I'll eventually turbocharge without ABS? I'll definitely put bigger brakes on, but on a scale of 1-10 how much of a difference will the ABS make, and if it will, how hard it the ABS bits to fit?

Also what about the gearbox?

Thanks your help!
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Old 06-12-2010, 08:25 PM   #5
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I'm with Tony get one that ha the v6 in it transfer all ur gear across to it and get a klze and drop it in. That way there is everything there gear box and all
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Old 06-12-2010, 09:27 PM   #6
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It's easier to start with a V6 base, as all the wiring is the same. From memory the V6 and 1.8 wiring shares little, so i think you'd have to change the interior and engine looms, which becomes a pain. Or maybe i'm thinking of JDM V6 vs AUSDM V6 - can't remember.

You'll need a BA V6 gearbox (or maybe the MX-6 one, not sure on that) as the 1.8 and V6 have different bellhousings. So new clutch, flywheel and driveshafts as well. Unless you've got a P1 BA, then the clutch/driveshafts are the same as V6

You'll need all new engine mounts too, except for the top gearbox mount (and maybe the rear depending on P1 or P2). Fuel pump will be fine.

You'll need the KL-ZE ECU as far as i can recall, as the AUSDM V6 Astina one doesn't work properly with the KL.

It's (relatively) easier to got BP-T from a BP base, as all the mounts/gearbox/wiring is basically plug and play. Much easier.

Where's Cosmo - he'll know
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Old 06-12-2010, 11:13 PM   #7
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Hi! in the philippines, were doing lots of conversion from the 1.6 which was all we had, to the type R V6 but we usually buy a half cut plus the rear suspension so everything is intact. We just disassemble everything from the half cut and re-assemble it on the existing car.
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Old 07-12-2010, 09:26 AM   #8
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Trans is different (bell housing and ratios), brake master is shorter to accomodate engine, drivers side driveshaft is different. Wiring looms are different, DE engine has EGR where ZE doesn't and ZE has knock sensor where DE doesn't. Engine loom plugs are different where they plug into the main loom, radiator, p/s pump and altenator are on different sides of the engine (re-wiring and re-plumbing), fans, brakes, rims and the list goes on...
By the time you've fixed half of this stuff you could have bought a V6 with a rough engine, completed the conversion and sold off your current ride.
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Old 07-12-2010, 05:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmo Dude View Post
Trans is different (bell housing and ratios), brake master is shorter to accomodate engine, drivers side driveshaft is different. Wiring looms are different, DE engine has EGR where ZE doesn't and ZE has knock sensor where DE doesn't. Engine loom plugs are different where they plug into the main loom, radiator, p/s pump and altenator are on different sides of the engine (re-wiring and re-plumbing), fans, brakes, rims and the list goes on...
By the time you've fixed half of this stuff you could have bought a V6 with a rough engine, completed the conversion and sold off your current ride.
That clarifies it clearly! What about buying a V6 and just transferring all of this to my current ride? I'm pretty attached to my car, and it's going through stages of having all the clear coat and some bits re-sprayed atm so not to keen on selling otherwise I'll loose out in the pocket!

But then I'll have to buy a wrecked V6 astina then the engine.

But I guess in turn I won't need a gearbox or to upgrade the brakes and what not.

Ah I don't know, I'm confused
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Old 07-12-2010, 06:20 PM   #10
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are you off your p-plates?
if so id recommend going the FI way of BP rather than fcuking around with either converting the i4-v6 or buying another car and swapping everything over and then upgrading the engine.. in any case that will be your cheapest, quickest and most rewarding option. assuming you will rebuild the engine with forged internals and with stock compression and 8psi that comes around 3500rpm you should have a very responsive zippy car that will still be very economical at cruising speeds (2.5-3K). if you want more power then get lower comp pistons and more boost.. just my 5c (seeing as tho 2c doesnt exist here )
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Old 07-12-2010, 06:38 PM   #11
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If you could find a Lantis front cut then I'd leap at it.
KF-DE Astina = 104Kw
KF-ZE Lantis = 130Kw
KF-ZE other =120Kw
You'd also get all parts needed for the legendary climate control install
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Old 08-12-2010, 06:54 AM   #12
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damo like they have said its way to much effort going from I4 to v6
and if you want a jap spec engine your gonna need a front cut to do it easliy
for dollar for dollar fun just rebuild and turbo your current engine (or find another BP which is also much easier than finding a klze) or get a BPT
also it is cheaper to build a I4 than a v6
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Old 08-12-2010, 11:16 AM   #13
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AH okay!
So, I'm on my P's. Still going to be for another 2 years. That's why I'm looking at it from this direction of a V6 first, then to turbo the V6. But would I get the same performance from the I4 turbo over the V6 turbo, common sense tells me no, but I could be wrong.

So, I go sell my car, buy a V6. THEN chuck a KL into it, and further down the track, TURBO

Thanks guys.
If anyone knows of a good V6, let me know.

Also, looks like I'll be selling my car. Let me know if your interested!
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Old 08-12-2010, 11:25 AM   #14
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But would I get the same performance from the I4 turbo over the V6 turbo
A BP-T can give you more power than you can put to the ground, quite easily.

Turbo K series can and has been done...but have you seen the space under the bonnet of a V6? Good luck
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Old 08-12-2010, 11:36 AM   #15
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A BP-T can give you more power than you can put to the ground, quite easily.

Turbo K series can and has been done...but have you seen the space under the bonnet of a V6? Good luck
Ah Well then I'll just turbo the I4, regardless of the laws

Just when I see figures from turbo'd I4's, I see 140kw-150kw atw. Which to me doesn't seem like a huge amount.

Well should I stick with the I4, work the internals with the money I would of spent on a KL, then turbo. OR, as said above Help.
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Old 08-12-2010, 12:08 PM   #16
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What are you comparing 150kw atw to? In a 1200kg BA or a 1800kg Commodore? It doesn't seem like much, but you've got much lighter weight which is a big advantage. 150kw atw will still get you 6 second 0-100 times and 13-14sec 1/4 mile times. Last time i checked this wasn't exactly slow

Or if you really want to do the V6 thing, then a slightly tweaked KL-ZE will get you much the same figures.
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Old 08-12-2010, 12:27 PM   #17
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if i was in your position id just turbo the BP
hell of a lot easier (in reguards to space,time and parts avaliablity etc)
like rupe said a BP turbo would give you all the power you would ever need
look at micks car that thing beats wrx's
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Old 08-12-2010, 12:37 PM   #18
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Don't forget the FE3
I'm toying with this thought at the moment however it's not the most common conversion.
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Old 08-12-2010, 01:41 PM   #19
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Don't forget the FE3
I'm toying with this thought at the moment however it's not the most common conversion.
FE3?

Quote:
What are you comparing 150kw atw to? In a 1200kg BA or a 1800kg Commodore? It doesn't seem like much, but you've got much lighter weight which is a big advantage. 150kw atw will still get you 6 second 0-100 times and 13-14sec 1/4 mile times. Last time i checked this wasn't exactly slow

I'm comparing it to say turbo in a sr20 sss. they hit upwards of 200kw, in something the same weight, or maybe a touch more. Thats all. I was looking for something that would ive me a figure like that!
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Old 08-12-2010, 02:01 PM   #20
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FE3 or FE twin cam is a two litre inline 4 cylinder from the JDM GD Cappella (626). It's kinda the best bits of the BP engine in a strong two litre engine.

http://www.astinagt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14863
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