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Old 30-07-2006, 11:01 AM   #21
Astro Boy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xedos
If the cop itimidated you get a good lawyer and you will get off.
Or write a really good letter!

Here's mine!

Quote:
10 May 2006

QLD Police HQ
GPO Box 1440
Brisbane QLD 4001

Dear Sir or Madam

RE: Infringement Notice – A 2697087 8

I am writing to you with respect to some grave concerns I have regarding the issue of the above alleged traffic infringement notice dated 10 May 2006 (copy included for your records).

Firstly, the location in which the above infringement notice remarks this alleged offence as happening has me at substantial unrest for several reasons. In a voice-recorded thirty-one second conversation I have of the issuing officer and myself, he clearly remarks when questioned about the alleged offence, “I was sitting in Rogers Parade East…�

Now according to the above infringement notice the alleged offence took place in the suburb of McDowall. This has me concerned for a number of reasons. After an exhaustive search of recognised directory ‘UDB Brisbane’ both the 48th and 50th editions, fail to find a location matching ‘Rogers Parade East, McDowall’. Bewildered by such controversy, my next step was to resort to well acknowledged online street directory ‘whereis.com.au’. To my surprise and agitation, an online search also fails to match such an address.

Unless the issuing officer was unlikely pinpointing more than one suburb at a time, his location simply does not exist, which brings me to my next point of substantial unrest, which is my alleged location.

On the night of the 10th May I attended a meeting at the clubrooms of a sporting organisation I’m involved with, and this meeting was held at West End. Now at the conclusion of this meeting (circa 21:50, to which many can validate), I had no other intended location other than home. Now living in Cashmere, I would only have traveled outbound along main routes, namely Kelvin Grove Rd, South Pine Rd, Old Northern Rd and Eatons Crossing Rd. At NO point in a transverse north along such routes do I enter, nor pass through McDowall, as alleged by the above infringement notice.

If you could explain as to why both the location of the issuing officer and the alleged offence simply don’t exist, it would be to the benefit of all involved.


Now in the second part of this voiced-recorded conversation the issuing officer concedes he was sitting, “…not this set of lights, but the previous set of lights�. Having been pulled over on Old Northern Rd outbound, just short of Collins Rd, Everton Hills, I set out to retrace my path. Intrigued as to where this mystery location is, I immediately return to this prescribed position, which although most certainly not in McDowall, does show evidence of motorcycle tyre disturbances, and will herein be known as the location. Of most concern is this location contravenes a number of guidelines clearly set out in the Australian Standards for Radar Detection AS2898 or Lidar AS4691:

2.4.2 Electromagnetic interference (EMI)
The operator shall ensure that the effects of electromagnetic interference are minimized by careful site selection.


In spite of the issuing officer clearly admitting he was sitting at a set of high voltage signal lights, thus susceptible to electromagnetic frequency disturbances, I set out to do my own examination of the location. Keeping in mind speed detection devices use a frequency close to both visible light, and EMF, what I find next shocks me.
Within a relatively small radius, I find:
· High voltage meter box Serial Number M2172;
· Six high voltage turn signal poles, all with one or more lamps illuminated, including two with less than four meters proximity;
· Four high voltage street lamps, all illuminated;
· Two further green power boxes, one of which is located less than 5m from the estimated location and;
· One set of high-tension power lines, adjacent to the location.

Further to AS2898, AS4691:

2.4.3 Reflections from stationary objects
The operator shall ensure that the radar beam is not being reflected away from the direction in which it is being aimed by stationary objects as this may lead to incorrect target identification.
NOTE: Typical stationary reflective objects are advertising hoardings, traffic signs, parked vehicles, metallic fences, sheds and phone boxes.


Further investigation of the location reveals that in a required line of sight detection there is more than one anomaly with this standard:
· One metallic sign, approx. two meters by one meter, “Queens Rd, Beckett Rd, Rode Rd�, directly in line of sight of the road.
· One further metallic sign, black and white in colour, approx. one meter by 0.5 meter in size, once again, directly in line of sight.
It is of my believe that one or more of the above disregards for stipulated standards, may have contributed to a reading, which, in contradiction to the speedometer in the alleged vehicle, has it going substantially faster. This is despite the alleged vehicle’s six-month-old speedometer having been required to be within a 10% tolerance above 40km/hr as laid out in the Australian Design Rules Section 18.

If you could provide some substantiated verification that it was indeed my vehicle being sighted, that would also be appreciated, as to date, I have seen none.

If you could further provide proof that such detection complies with the Australian National Measurement Act of 1960, I would be grateful, as currently I am of the belief that it does not.
In conclusion I would like an explanation as to how a vehicle can commit an offence in a location, which by all accounts, does not exist according to the infringement notice issued. I would also like a justifiable reason as to why the officer chose a location that has breached more than one guideline as detailed in the Australian Standards.

Mind you for all the above reasons I see it not unreasonable if you want to let it go, and close the matter here. However, should you wish to pursue the matter further, I am only too happy to discuss any further complications in the surroundings of a court room, accompanied by the appropriate legal professionals, at great time and expense to us both. Prior to such an event I would like access under the Freedom of Information Act of 1992 to both the issuing officer’s training record on such equipment, and a recent calibration certificate or similar of the detection device used on the night of the 10th May 2006.

Thank you for your time, and I look forward to hearing your favorable response soon.

Yours sincerely,





Greg Latham

Encl. Copy of Infringement Notice A 2697087 8
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Old 30-07-2006, 12:18 PM   #22
chicaboo
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And what was their reply?
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Old 30-07-2006, 12:27 PM   #23
andrewgrazier
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well the best part is that you got the suspension lifted so far
i cant really say anything good about cops
sadly its because i know who have become policemen, and of when **** has happend to me like when the house got broken into, n other stuff stolen, the cops simply just go yeah well that happens sometimes n thats about as far as things get fixed up.


ive just heard another rumour about speed cameras that most of them r being replaced
like all the digital ones are geting replaced cause they cant prove that the photograph is real and has not been edited.
n some of the ones with film are out of film
so they will flash but nothing else will happen.
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Old 30-07-2006, 03:10 PM   #24
EddyEdwards
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewgrazier
well the best part is that you got the suspension lifted so far
i cant really say anything good about cops
sadly its because i know who have become policemen, and of when **** has happend to me like when the house got broken into, n other stuff stolen, the cops simply just go yeah well that happens sometimes n thats about as far as things get fixed up.


ive just heard another rumour about speed cameras that most of them r being replaced
like all the digital ones are geting replaced cause they cant prove that the photograph is real and has not been edited.
n some of the ones with film are out of film
so they will flash but nothing else will happen.
Hopefully that means the one at Sandgate will die!!! I fooking hate that camera.
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Old 30-07-2006, 03:28 PM   #25
mrpayner
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Astro, that letter seems to be very well researched and written, a commendable effort!
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Old 30-07-2006, 03:52 PM   #26
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Only thing missing on that letter would be the words 'Without Prejudice' on the line before 'Dear Sir/Madam'.
It limits any implied liabilities included within the letter.

Else, good job. I will save a copy of that just in case.
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Old 30-07-2006, 08:03 PM   #27
Astro Boy
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Well its still under investigation 5 months later, but basically, it was 84 in a 60 zone (4 points and $250), a month before rally Q at a time when i had to spend every dollar on rebuilding the new rally car, so simply to have it delayed was my main goal...

BUT, having not got a speeding fine in 2 years, i then got one the following week for 1 point... Now still being a P plater i would have either lost my licence or gone on a good behaviour bond, which doesn't look good on my application to become an accredited driver trainer in 12 months, so if i can delay having to pay it till after Sep 10, when i get my opens, i should be sweet...

The fact that the officer couldn't even get the suburb right left the door pretty open to have an attack, then it just kinda flowed from there!

For those interested its gonna cost me about $3200 bucks to get the required qualification even just to apply, with no guarantee they'll pass it... Hopefully completing the AAMI Skilled Drivers Course and The WRX Experience within a week of getting my P plates shows i'm serious about driver training, and having a state rallying title and genuine motorsport experience should help my application...

Basically you need a Cert. IV in Training and Assesment, which i'm doing through tafe atm, then you need to go up grade that to a Cert. IV in Driving Instruction, which some of the larger driving school can offer... Oh, and you need to have held your opens for 12 months... so i can't apply till i'm 21yrs and 3 days!!!

Pre-license stuff would be crap i reckon, so my plan is to grow a single car driving school business around the 'GSL RallySport' branding, then sell it and move onto advanced driver training, in either my own business or someone elses... meh, we'll see how it goes!
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Old 31-07-2006, 11:12 AM   #28
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IS there not also some rule about the spped limit not being enforceable until 200m from where the signs started for the new limit.

I recall this as it made a lot of school zones in NSW totally redundant.

not sure if a resolution has been passed.



My first RBT,
I happily pull over all exicted about my first RBT, Knew I was fine,
Anyway,
IS that a en expired Rego, ?(Umm yeah the new ones at home its just around the corner)
Liceanse please, Here you go,
Where do you live, about 3 blocks that way,
how long have you lived there, 3 months,
Says here you a p plater, umm yeah.

OK so what have we got here,
$100 2 points no p PLates
$400(ish) no current rego
$400(ish) displaying old rego
$200 not updating home address within two weeks of moving,

FARK, your kidding.

But I'll just get you for the P Plates,




Dodgiest let off ever accquaintance of mine

Speeding, unregoed and unroadworthy car, Partially drunk, without a license and with a Large Bag of something the cops would be interested in in the boot

He got let off with a warning.
FYI he would be in court or jail if they opened the boot.

He told me just after I lost 6 points for 72 in 50 during double demerits, could of slapped him. shouldve



And nice letter,
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Old 31-07-2006, 11:47 AM   #29
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Skippy: not sure about the 200m rule. Prob not, in Queensland at least.

Last time i went looking for the definition of "hooning" i found nothing in the legislations that gave the specifics of how they could fine you , and what they could fine you for. They can get you for "suspected" street racing...not even actual proven dragging off the lights...nope, just suspected street racing. Which means that every single skyline owner in brisbane probably gets booked everytime they take their car down the road to get a loaf of bread!.

Not making any excuses for Ryan here (that was a little silly mate..), but the police have powers with regards to "hoons" and "street racers" that defy logic and reasoning. THAT irritates me. I've got no probs with the police doing their jobs, but when the "laws" they are asked to enforce are purely based on the point of view of delusional 70 something grandmothers who watch today tonight, it gets on my goat a little...
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Old 31-07-2006, 12:35 PM   #30
skippy
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Then it becomes a debate of letter of the law Vs intent of the law,
I think they write road laws so they can he as adjustable as possible,
Example who was that celeb/polly got caught flying in a sportscar but got let off cause he was doing it safely in a car designed for speed.


only road law I really hate is that leggally you have no right to beatup people who hit your car then drive off.


Lastly a quote I think of while I am driving,

Ever notice how everyone faster than you is a maniac and everyone slower is an idiot.
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Old 31-07-2006, 12:40 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skippy
Then it becomes a debate of letter of the law Vs intent of the law,
I think they write road laws so they can he as adjustable as possible,
Example who was that celeb/polly got caught flying in a sportscar but got let off cause he was doing it safely in a car designed for speed.


only road law I really hate is that leggally you have no right to beatup people who hit your car then drive off.


Lastly a quote I think of while I am driving,

Ever notice how everyone faster than you is a maniac and everyone slower is an idiot.
oh its definantly something worth debating.. and i'd love to see what happens when someone gets their shiney new ferrari confiscated for "hooning".

the point is though, that you dont get to keep your car while you are disputing it. They can INSTANTLY confiscate your ride for 48 hours (more for multiple offences).

even a slight breaking of traction (such as chirping if your foot slips off the clutch or something) could be considered hooning.

Obviously none of these laws have been contested properly...but it stinks that with absolutely nothing more then a "suspision" the long arm of the law can take your car off y ou for 48 hours.
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Old 01-08-2006, 12:16 AM   #32
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skippy: lol large bag
thats pretty harsh for a 1st rbt as well! but i guess they were doing their job

sorry for the slow pickup and for not reading half the posts here, but was the accord the cop car? never heard of an unmarked accord! i'll have to be careful the next time i go to eastwood
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Old 01-08-2006, 05:18 AM   #33
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sunshine coast have 3 new accords as unmarked cars. i can now spot them a mile away. they are nowhere near as fast as the regular cars but still can keep a good pace.

ryan
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Old 01-08-2006, 04:43 PM   #34
Astro Boy
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i can vouch for that! I've seen cops hanging out the passenger door of one with a gun...
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