DRIVING TECHNIQUE

[nalawa]

Two quick questions for the gurus

1. Does anyone know of a good web site that discusses FWD driving techniques? Been looking since I bought the car without much luck. Having only eevr driven RWD cars I am interested if their are any major differences, especially emergency type stuff (eg skids)

2. Which font is used to make the ASTINAGT logo?

Cheers in advance

Chris

[chicaboo]

With a FWD, you can actually steer the car with the accelerator peddle to some degree. Generally if you accelrate into a corner and back off the throttle half way through, the car will throw the arse out. Getting back on the throttle quickly will get you back into a safe driving line. Depending on how much suspension work you've had done will change how severe this throttle-off oversteer action can be. I know it sounds scary, but you tend to be better off accelerating through the whole corner to hold a tight line... But if you are not used to this then just take it easy and drive safe, otherwise you'll be kissing the guardrail.
Because the 323's have a good torque curve, they can crab a little bit from a set of lights on a wet road if you are too sudden on the peddle (and it doesn't take much to do this either!). The car will generally pull to the left, but can at times slap to the right suddenly when you change gear or lift off the peddle suddenly. It all realy depends whats under your tyres at the time they lose grip. But beware this crabbing can be at times enough to drive you sideways into another car, so if you feel it happening ease off the throttle gently and you will be fine.
The only other thing I can think of this that you may have better engine braking because the front wheels are loaded up and shouldn't lockup like they could on a RWD.
Good luck, and have some happy and safe driving, if it feels dangerous, don't do it.
Gav.

[Rupewrecht]

Originally Posted by nalawa

2. Which font is used to make the ASTINAGT logo?

ask Mazda!

Xedos redrew it from a scan of the logo

[Cosmo Dude]

Without actually pushing your car to the limit you won't experience the magic of a FWD.
To do it somewhat safely games like Need for Speed Underground I and II are fantastic simulators.


You can handbrake and accelerate simultaneously in a FWD. It's insane Do it well and you will be rewarded.
On the flip side if you exceed the limits of your tyres with your engine you will know all about understeer. :?

[Mizda_Mazda]

Yeh, RWD and FWD are very different. I learnt to drive in my astina and when i got my skyline, i found braking and accelerating times where different, but with each car, your trying to push out (accelerate) just before the apex of the corner. Down shifting is easier in a FWD, as it doesn't throw the car into a oversteer/drift, and I also feel that braking/braking cornering is better in a FWD, but this could be that my astina has better suspension to my skyline :P, not to mention the weight.

But definately FWD and RWD are two different styles of driving.

Just take it easy, and it will come naturally to you. You'll feel your car complain if you drive it the wrong way.


If you start to understeer, back off on the throttle, and it should suddenly grip(becareful).

Keep the engine in gear when slowing down, and don't ride the clutch.

[Asterix]

Yeah, Chicaboo is right.
I like to think of FWDing as "Point & Shoot".
You can throttle into a corner & rip the foot off the accelerator & watch the arse kick out. Then (in the correct gear for your speed) you can aim the steering wheel & plant the gas again - Easy.
Hooning on grass in a FWD is my personal favourite & the best way to learn how your car handles. Collect some speed, gently pull up the handbrake until the rear wheels lock & then steer left & right. If things get messy, just release the handbrake & power out of the slide. With a bit of practice, you can throw some great angles for a long drift.

[twilightprotege]

FWD drifting rocks!

[platypus]

asterix, its more fun in reverse!!!!


umm this may sound really daft, but pick up a copy of gran turismo 4 prolouge.. sure you can't practice all the things you did on the game but it actually goes through a lot of FWD driving techniques!!!

[nalawa]

Thanks Guys for the tips!

At my age (41) I have passed the need for speed (most of the time) and just enjoy getting the car to handle through nice twisty roads :twisted: Which is why next year (sometime) I will upgrade the shock, springs and sway bars. Have been reading a bit about power on/off understeer so thanks for the advice, always like to apex a corner right and drive out. Years of riding a motor cycle taught me all about position on the road and setting up for entry and exit to corners.

As for crabbing I have noticed that a little, especially on an uphill start in the wet. Get on the gas a little heavy and she starts to shudder and move. Very different from the 78 model Cressida!

I will have to have a look at Gran Turismo 4or NFSUGII! I've got a copy of NFS4PU which was always lots of fun. Who said computer games aren't educational?

Cheers again guys

Chris

[Red Frog]

let me tell you suspension makes a hell of a difference in a front wheel drive. i have an awesome rear swaybar on my car and, imo, great tyres. all put together + good reaction time, pulled me thru what could have been a nasty accident the other day. a swerve to the right followed instantly by a swerve to the left to miss a fuking nth shore mummy in her 4wd with major bullbar coming out of a driveway without looking. i was so proud how my car handled my quick reaction and i can confidently say the swaybar played a major part. i used to drive a rwd and occasionally still do from time to time and find it loves fishtailing, which the fwd doesn't seem to do. thou my car does seem to crab a bit. too much power i spose :twisted:

[chipa]

Just watch out as Need for Speed Underground II is damn addictive. I just cracked it last night and I reckon my xbox needs a rest!

[lamby1986]

as for FWD driving techniques, you could always try left foot braking...

Originally Posted by Cosmo Dude

You can handbrake and accelerate simultaneously in a FWD. It's insane Do it well and you will be rewarded.

the concept is simple enough, just hard to master. use your left foot to brake lightly while using your right foot to punch the accelerator. the idea is that in a tight corner, or uphill, or both, a FWD car will want to understeer out of the corner unless taken at slower speeds. this is due to the weight transfering to the rear wheels, not the front where the traction is needed. To make the car turn faster you have to cancel the weight transfer effects by using the accelerator and brake in combination.

very hard to master this, due to the natural left foot dendancy to punch the clutch, when you try to make it use the brake 'lightly' it plain doesn't want to. first time i tried braking with my left foot in a straight line (just checking out the possibility), locked up the wheels :roll: i've never even done that in an emergency situation with my right foot :lol: Im better at it, but i still corner faster under normal cornering that with the left foot braking technique.

as for NFSU and NFSU2, finished the first one 6 times, and up to 60% on my second run through number 2. absolutely awesome, although there are better 'simulators' out there, its the entire package that makes the games.[/url]

[lamby1986]

for further reading on LFB:

http://www.rallyracingnews.com/lfb.html

[Rupewrecht]

Originally Posted by lamby1986

as for FWD driving techniques, you could always try left foot braking...

...which is also good for spooling up a turbo that's laggy

[Astro Boy]

ok... i forget who said it BUT... if your using your gearbox to brake to the point ANYWHERE NEAR locking wheels (are your not running a dogbox)... you are going to do serious damage to your gears... gears are only designed to take pressure in one direction... simple.. gears are for going... brakes are for stopping

yes left foot braking is a fantastic thing, i used it all the time (i have my reasons :wink, but having said that i'm yet to find anything on the internet that explains it properly.. and it certainly isn't confined to FWD... Greg Murphy ONLY brakes with his left foot... don't also think that its entirely necessary... in rally where its regarded as a neccesity.. there are guys at the top (Dean Herridge) who don't use it... even in a FWD car, on bitumen its next to useless... on a track, with a car with very hard suspension, yes it becomes neccessary cause lift off (throttle) oversteer has very little effect...

on the dirt, in my FWD rally car, i do more steering with my left foot than the wheel... that's a fact, all the wheel does it turn the car in, but in order to mantain throttle i use the brake to control where the nose of the car points.. that way the front wheels can point straight ahead and be ready to take power application... in a fwd car your asking the fronts to both take power, and turn the car... they inheritently understeer, regardless of what your doing with the brake.....

a fwd car responds better to trail braking too... maintaining loading over the front wheels whilst corner assists in putting power down on exit... also, with a fwd car if you lock the wheels, then get off the brake, the wheels start turing alot sooning that with a RWD car.. so dont be afraid to brake late and take a risk.. (speaking of which... my buzzbox rally car, running good tyres, lucas pads, and standard brakes, pulls more braking g's than a V8 supercar 1.15g vs 1.05g... just ask nate about the headaches i gave him :P )

also... in FWD cars that don't have an lsd.. sometimes disconnecting the front sway bar will improve handling because it won't try to lift the inside wheel up as much.. (my car doesn't have a front sway bar, and don't try arguing about how it handles over glorious)... this doesn't matter in a RWD car... but in a FWD car, loss of grip, means it sends all the power to that wheel.. meaning you lose drive on the one that's doing the turning.... also, in order to put power down properly you need to have the front wheels facing near enough to straight..

yes on dirt, a FWD car will be able to put power down ALOT sooner than a RWD car.. but on bitumen that isn't always the case... if your tyres are already at the limit of adhesion during cornering, and you try putting drive through them aswell, it doesn't work... try it in the wet.. go round a big corner (with plenty of space), then try putting full power down.. the wheels spin and you car goes straigh ahead.... and that lfb website was only refering to dirt technique, and it did a good job.. but had nothing to do with driving a car on the black stuff...

anyways... its getting late, so i'm off..

[Cosmo Dude]

For most people FWD and RWD need no difference in driving style.
I like the RWD when circuit racing and FWD for Motorkhana, it's only when I'm really tossing the car 'round that it makes a significant difference otherwise I'll adjust accordingly.
If you want to learn the best way is through doing and a good way is through armature motor sport. It's off the road in a safe and well organised environment.

[platypus]

CAMS pretesting courses will teach you a lot...

and my high recommendation is in the method of double declutching, and heel and toeing... this won't make you a better driver, but will improve times, while keeping the power on

[Astro Boy]

Originally Posted by ahb11m

this won't make you a better driver

it will in the wet.. :wink:

[platypus]

Originally Posted by Bourne Boy

it will in the wet.. :wink:

good point my friend

[chipa]

Originally Posted by ahb11m

and my high recommendation is in the method of double declutching, and heel and toeing...

I couldn't agree more... I've been heel & toeing for so long I do it constantly. Even when I don't need too. It's only a tiny fraction more wear on your clutch, but it's heaps cheaper than fixing your gearbox. It also keeps your driving smoother and therefore faster....